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-   -   BEAM EXTENDER "FAQ" THE BASICS 101 (http://volksrods.com/forum/showthread.php?t=29555)

Jon February 12th, 2010 03:31 AM

Re: BEAM EXTENDER "FAQ" THE BASICS 101
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Dbug41 (Post 444349)
I've been asked several times about steering shaft modification
here are some pic's of one I did for Al Low Ha


Attachment 22408

cut 7" out of the middle

Attachment 22409

Used an inner sleeve of 5/8" 18 ga tubing about 6" long
to help with alignment

Attachment 22410

leave a 3/32 gap to pound the weld in deep

Attachment 22411

that way the weld deserves minimal sanding to become flush

Attachment 22412

easy peasy qiuck sand blast and done



enjoy A Low Ha ! sent it today "priority"

Would have been alot less work if you lopped the end off the required amountand cut a slot and a notch, much the same way you shorten Tie Rods without the tapping. This way you have a solid continuos shaft free of welds that probably won't break but could if somone who wasn't a great welder.
Just throwing this out there for an optional approach.

PureC4 said "Oh, and did I say I love Dbug's 10" :funny::funny::funny:
Sorry out of context quotes are funny sometimes. Congrats on the 10" Dbug. Impressive.:thumbsup:

PureC4 February 12th, 2010 04:05 AM

Re: BEAM EXTENDER "FAQ" THE BASICS 101
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Jon (Post 446214)
PureC4 said "Oh, and did I say I love Dbug's 10" :funny::funny::funny:
Sorry out of context quotes are funny sometimes. Congrats on the 10" Dbug. Impressive.:thumbsup:

New I was in trouble when I posted that..... but hell if we can't laugh at ourselves what the use? right ....besides 10" is nothing to laugh at! :ohmy:. But seriously the extender looks great, and works better. I could have saved me a bunch of money I spent on the straight axle setup I used to run. That only looked good and drove like shit. This is the way to go for sure.

Al Low Ha February 12th, 2010 10:20 AM

Re: BEAM EXTENDER "FAQ" THE BASICS 101
 
AND a big Mahalo to you Doug for providing the shaft and mods! My plan is to install the steering shaft this weekend! It's gonna be rough going cause I threw out my back Monday...but I'm itching to get the 56 'steerable'....Thanks again!
Aloha

Dbug41 February 12th, 2010 06:42 PM

Re: BEAM EXTENDER "FAQ" THE BASICS 101
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Jon (Post 446214)
Would have been alto less work if you lopped the end off the required amount and cut a slot and a notch, much the same way you shorten Tie Rods without the tapping. This way you have a solid continuous shaft free of welds that probably won't break but could if someone who wasn't a great welder.
Just throwing this out there for an optional approach.

I thought about that:thumbsup: but the wall thickness on this shaft was different in then the very end then the middle ( see the last pic the I.D. Being smaller then the end that fit) i would have spent a hour with die grinder just to make it fit. this shaft was out of a 66 i have noticed this on all the one's that I've seen and done. I'm not discounting you experience I just haven't seen a steering shaft that would allow that without allot more work:Idunno: I could be wrong though



heres a web page with an astro van option
http://www.crankshaftcoalition.com/w...junkyard_parts

howirolla February 21st, 2010 06:37 PM

Re: BEAM EXTENDER "FAQ" THE BASICS 101
 
Ok so my question is if the caster angle wasent compensated for on the longer extensions what sort of effects will it have other than heavier steering?

Unkl Ian February 21st, 2010 06:41 PM

Re: BEAM EXTENDER "FAQ" THE BASICS 101
 
The compensation adds more caster, so you don't need the caster shims commonly used with lowered beams.

Dbug41 February 21st, 2010 07:18 PM

Re: BEAM EXTENDER "FAQ" THE BASICS 101
 
Caster


Caster is the angle between the steering axis and the vertical axis as viewed from the side of the car. Caster affects straight-line stability and "camber gain". Positive caster is when the top of the steering axis is tilted back (steering axis intersects the ground in front of the tire contact patch). Negative caster is when the top of the steering axis is tilted forward (steering axis intersects the ground behind the tire contact patch). I have never seen negative caster used, and I do not believe it is beneficial in automobile suspension geometry. Therefore, for the rest of this section, when I refer to caster, I am talking about positive caster.


To visualize caster, think about the wheels of a shopping cart. The steering axis of the wheel intersects the ground far ahead of where the wheel touches the ground. As a result, the wheel is essentially dragged behind the steering axis. This keeps the wheel moving straight. If the steering axis intersected the ground at the same spot that the wheel touched the ground, then there would be no caster effect. The wheel would be free to spin around the steering axis as long as it was not held in place by some other force.
Unlike in a shopping cart, the steering axis on a car is placed close to the hub of the wheel. Therefore, the only way to make the steering axis intersect the ground ahead of the tire contact patch is to tilt the steering axis. The more the axis is tilted (in the positive caster direction), the greater the caster effect.
http://www.240edge.com/performance/caster_small.jpgExample of Positive Caster (Side View)
Enlarge
Large caster settings increase the tendency of the front wheels to center themselves. This tendency is mainly due to the camber gain that occurs when the steering axis is tilted and the wheels are turned. Camber gain involved with caster is not easy to visualize. Think about the extreme case where the steering axis is tilted to the point where it is horizontal. When you turn the steering wheel, the front wheels would stand up on their edges. If you turn left, the left tire will stand on its outer edge, and the right tire will stand on its inner edge. If you turn right, the left tire will stand on its inner edge the right on its outer edge. The same type of camber gain, only on a smaller scale, takes place with less caster. This camber gain is exactly what you want in a corner. Read the previous section on camber to see what it is and why itís beneficial.
When the tires stand up on their edges, the front of the car is actually raised up. This is why the wheels "center themselves" when you let go of the steering wheel. The weight of the car pushes the wheels flat on the ground, which resets the steering. This improves high-speed stability because it keeps the steering firmly in the center position. However, it is difficult to turn a car with a large caster setting because, while turning, you are actually lifting the front of the car with the steering. This effect is most visible in luxury sedans, where high-speed stability is important and sophisticated power steering makes up for the extra steering effort. If you watch one of these cars as the wheels turn to full lock (maximum steering angle), you will see the front end of the car rise slightly.
Increased caster is advantageous for racing and, in some cases, street driving. The only disadvantage is the added steering effort. While camber gain due to caster is generally good for increasing the grip of the front tires in a corner, too much camber gain will cause the tires to heat up, lose grip, and wear out prematurely. Therefore, do not use more than a few degrees of caster. If your car uses a MacPherson Strut suspension, it may be necessary to modify or install new strut tower mounts to be able to adjust caster.

that should about cover it :thumbsup:

Dbug41 March 12th, 2010 06:33 PM

Re: BEAM EXTENDER "FAQ" THE BASICS 101
 
2 Attachment(s)
Attachment 23124Attachment 23126

This is an example of the 10" beam extender on Dirtbags ride

This is an example of the 8" beam extender on Palepainters ride

hotrod March 13th, 2010 01:24 PM

Re: BEAM EXTENDER "FAQ" THE BASICS 101
 
Is there a way to extend the beam but leave the steering box a little behind? perhaps a custom fabbed bracket

Steve

Dbug41 March 13th, 2010 04:34 PM

Re: BEAM EXTENDER "FAQ" THE BASICS 101
 
3 Attachment(s)
There is probably a way to do it
this is one way
Thank you Hotrodheb

Attachment 23130

Attachment 23131

you might run into interference with the steering links

Attachment 23132

hotrod March 13th, 2010 04:55 PM

Re: BEAM EXTENDER "FAQ" THE BASICS 101
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Dbug41 (Post 451973)
There is probably a way to do it
this is one way
Thank you Hotrodheb

Attachment 23130

Attachment 23131

you might run into interference with the steering links

Attachment 23132

Cool, thanks Dbug41, I like the look of the beam but fond of the look of the steering poking out the front

StickerDick March 13th, 2010 06:05 PM

Re: BEAM EXTENDER "FAQ" THE BASICS 101
 
Mine came today, Thanks dbug, looks great!

Bugzie March 15th, 2010 04:06 PM

Re: BEAM EXTENDER "FAQ" THE BASICS 101
 
Got my extender today. Thanks, Doug. Now I just have to find the time to get it installed and braced.

Bugzie

white64 March 15th, 2010 05:39 PM

Re: BEAM EXTENDER "FAQ" THE BASICS 101
 
Got Mine Saturday! Looks great! Thanks!

Bracing.... from the old axle location, or the new extended axle location?

StickerDick March 15th, 2010 06:03 PM

Re: BEAM EXTENDER "FAQ" THE BASICS 101
 
Yea, explian this bracing thing, why and how?

bigguy March 15th, 2010 06:07 PM

Re: BEAM EXTENDER "FAQ" THE BASICS 101
 
Extra force on frame head and to firewall sheetmetal and maybe to the center spine to. Look up speedfreak bracing.

GlowstickNinja March 15th, 2010 06:37 PM

Re: BEAM EXTENDER "FAQ" THE BASICS 101
 
The physics behind it.........

the force of the suspension system is placed at a further distance from the bulk head. This creates a larger cantilever force on the components that would normally withstand this force. Hence the need for bracing.

Basically you are protecting the frame/firewall from buckling due to this extra force. The bracing distributes the force more evenly through the frame and/or makes it more rigid.

larryn2o March 18th, 2010 05:37 PM

Re: BEAM EXTENDER "FAQ" THE BASICS 101
 
pm sent

thanks
larry

penono2 March 18th, 2010 06:20 PM

Re: BEAM EXTENDER "FAQ" THE BASICS 101
 
does anyone know if anyone has gone with the 10" then lengthened the hood just a hair?

Unkl Ian March 18th, 2010 06:53 PM

Re: BEAM EXTENDER "FAQ" THE BASICS 101
 
Might be easier to stretch the top of the cowl.

Palepainter March 18th, 2010 07:50 PM

Re: BEAM EXTENDER "FAQ" THE BASICS 101
 
I had considered slicing the cowl and then through the side of the front fender wells. you would basically slide it along a horizontal slice through the side of the fender well. You have to keep the relationship of the hood and the trunk area intact to make it work, but it is a way around it.

Unkl Ian March 18th, 2010 07:53 PM

Re: BEAM EXTENDER "FAQ" THE BASICS 101
 
Either way, you would have to rework the sides.

Less work/welding to trim the hood, then make up a blister to cover the box.

GlowstickNinja March 18th, 2010 09:46 PM

Re: BEAM EXTENDER "FAQ" THE BASICS 101
 
Or you can go with center steer.....I will be finishing my writeup with pics on this process. Either way if you don't want to trim the hood with the 10" then your in for some work.

StickerDick March 21st, 2010 06:13 AM

Re: BEAM EXTENDER "FAQ" THE BASICS 101
 
Trim the hood? Does anybody have pics of what that looks like, I have the 10" extneder, so pleaseshow me this trimming

AirheadZim March 21st, 2010 06:21 AM

Re: BEAM EXTENDER "FAQ" THE BASICS 101
 
Thats another reason why I'm going with the 8".


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