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Old November 23rd, 2011, 11:05 AM   #1
mikenite
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Default stromberg 97's

so i had the idea of running dual center mount 97's on my build for something a bit out of the box.... now I'm not asking how i should do it etc.... etc... I'm just wanting an opinion should i base the set-up of to existing manifolds grafted together or maybe one thing i was thinking was like a tunnel ram setup....

i dunno im gonna sketch something up and post that
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Old November 23rd, 2011, 11:39 AM   #2
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Default Re: stromberg 97's

Really doesn't matter HOW you do it 'cause it wouldn't work regardless.

Given the truth of it, I'd say to mount the 97's on top of ripe bananas for now. You'll get the exact same response if you were to spend time and money on a tunnel ram box or two single inlets fed to a single down pipe.

No matter how or where you mount those carbs on a VW engine, nothing good will happen.

Now . . . if you were to mount two stock SOLEX carbs in a row, like they might be mounted on a flat head or an L4 or something, talk to Dan (VWfanatic) and ask for some pics of the twin in-line manifold that I made for him.

Worked PERFECTLY ! ! !

Good luck with those banana manifolds . . .

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Old November 23rd, 2011, 12:10 PM   #3
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Default Re: stromberg 97's

Ummm bananafolds...
I was thinking they would prolly drop to much fuel and was considering doing dual Picts 34's I'll post my sketch up in a second
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Old November 23rd, 2011, 12:51 PM   #4
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Default Re: stromberg 97's



theres my terrible sketch while drinking to much coffee .... i got the idea for doing stromberg's from a lil story i read where some mechanic that couldnt figure out how to tune webers put strombergs on a 1.6l ferrari
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Old November 23rd, 2011, 01:00 PM   #5
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Default Re: stromberg 97's

Strombergs are fashionable with the "Traditional" herd.
If a Weber is an option, forget Stromberg.
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Old November 23rd, 2011, 01:02 PM   #6
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Default Re: stromberg 97's

Why center mounted ?
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Old November 23rd, 2011, 01:08 PM   #7
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Default Re: stromberg 97's

i loveeeeeeeeeee strombergs hahah but i guess ill be going with dual solexes in that configuration

i wouldnt mind doing this set up
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Old November 23rd, 2011, 01:14 PM   #8
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Default Re: stromberg 97's

Quote:
Originally Posted by Unkl Ian View Post
Why center mounted ?
i think it would look interesting seeing as its something not commonly done... granted it would be a PITA to tune due to the amount of manifold heat needed
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Old November 23rd, 2011, 04:20 PM   #9
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Default Re: stromberg 97's

I'd run dual small bugsprays before 97s. Better carbs and you can get jets at your local speed shop. Plus they were set up for a vw at one time. So they might not be impossible to set up.
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Old November 23rd, 2011, 04:33 PM   #10
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Default Re: stromberg 97's

true but the bug spray is just a modified 94 so its pretty close in design to the 97
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Old November 23rd, 2011, 05:01 PM   #11
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Default Re: stromberg 97's

put a Holley double pumper on it and forget about it!!
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Old November 23rd, 2011, 06:22 PM   #12
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Default Re: stromberg 97's

Why wouldnt they run good. As long as the CFM's arent too high why wouldn't it work ? Really similar to the Bugspray. as long as it could be jetted right and the manifold didnt ice up or get cold. Those are the tricks to getting a Progressive weber to run right.

I would rather run kadrons instead.
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Old November 24th, 2011, 07:00 AM   #13
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Default Re: stromberg 97's

here are some ideas. before i was going to put a corvair in the kdf i had a homemade 2x2 stromberg intake set up on it. still have it hanging on the wall in the shop. i used the stock gaskets to make the flanges for the haeds. then i bent up 4 pipes ti run up from the heads to the main intake. the main intake where the strombergs were was a piece of 2x 4 square tubing . i layed out the carbs and drilled and taped the tube for the carbs. now the intake has to come apart so i cut the 4 intake runners coming from the heads and put rubber sleaves on them. ( if toy google a corvair ieco intake you will get the idea) .
another way i did a dual stromberg intake was to run them ont eather side. making individual intakr runners.

people will say that the intake will never work, will never runn etc. will i have made many homemade intakes and they all will work its just amatter of how good they will work . if you make a center mounted 2x2 intake the fuel can pool in the bottom of it causing some restart issues. you just have to open the throttle plates up and turn her over abit.
thats my 2 cents
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Old November 24th, 2011, 05:22 PM   #14
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Default Re: stromberg 97's

AFAIK bugprays re updated 94 which were an updated 97's. The bugsprays do not have power valves in them while the v-8 carbs do. Those introduce another variable into tuning them. Plus bugsprays are cheaper because both 97's and 94's are in bigger demand with the flathead hot rod guys.
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Old November 24th, 2011, 06:04 PM   #15
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Default Re: stromberg 97's

thanks kdf! i have some ideas kicking around the old skull.

special-k: really? most of the bugsprays i find are barley serviceable and i find strombergs all the time that are rebuildable and running about 50 bucks each
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Old November 24th, 2011, 09:08 PM   #16
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Default Re: stromberg 97's

Really? seems to be the opposite around here. Good luck with whatever you decide anyways.
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Old November 24th, 2011, 10:44 PM   #17
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Default Re: stromberg 97's

thanks man i know its gonna be a hard to work out but if it was easy it would be more common plus i think it will be a very interesting setup

and as far as finding them the stombergs i have a hook up with an old junk man that has milk crates full of him i just have to catch him on a good day hes one of the today its 25 bucks each and the next day they will be 100 each types
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Old November 25th, 2011, 10:51 AM   #18
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Default Re: stromberg 97's

"put a Holley double pumper on it and forget about it!!"

I have a complete Johnny's Four Play set-up if you're interested. I don't have an engine big enough to run it.
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Old November 25th, 2011, 01:20 PM   #19
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Default Re: stromberg 97's

If you really DO get serious about a twin carb in-line manifold, remember that the linkage is going to have to be progressive (I can diagram out how to build that using just a spring and a short length of rod pretty much) and the carb nearest to the down tube will be the primary. The other carb shouldn't have a choke, accelerator pump, idle circuit, etc. That carb (the rear one) just opens up ready to rock and roll, no off-idle transition or any of that sort of thing. Almost like a progressive on-off switch.

As I mentioned, I made one (Dan currently has the manifold) set-up and had it on the 1776 that what in my bus/truck and it ran REALLY sweet. I'd recommend Solexes, but if you have a large enough engine and time/skill to re-work the carbs correctly) try whatever you can get your lil' grubbies on.
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Old November 25th, 2011, 03:35 PM   #20
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Default Re: stromberg 97's

im as serious as a heart attack possibly considering triple pict 30's
(im insane)
ive been working out the linkage in my mind and that seems the biggest issue
and i had the idea of setting them up as staged carbs like you mentioned
i would love to see the diagram you have ill pm you my manifold design im working on when it isnt on a napkin
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Old November 25th, 2011, 04:03 PM   #21
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Default Re: stromberg 97's

my buddy ran a 97 on his 1600dp and it ran fat at first, after tuneing it ran like a champ, oh no choke. I wanted to do the tri carb setup on my 65 . after talking to a carb guy on the samba and he told me it was a tuneing nitemare and the linkage was to. but a guy at the classic had the tri carbs and it ran good.
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Old November 25th, 2011, 05:26 PM   #22
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Default Re: stromberg 97's

Just to give you a rough idea of the linkage idea using something familiar to most of us. Imagine two stock Solex carbs mounted in-line on an extended length manifold such as you designed.

A basic throttle cable running up to them but fastened to a thin metal rod. Imagine the little end piece on the stock VW cable that fits into the barrel connector but extended to about six/seven inches long.

Easy to fashion out of tubing and JB Weld.

The rod runs through both barrel connectors on the carbs linkage arms. The front carb (closest to the down pipe) has the little screw tighten in on the barrel connector just like it was stock. Done, the rod is tightly in place just as though it was that little tube like extension on the end of a stock throttle cable.

The barrel connector on the rear most carb has no little set screw and the rod simply runs straight through the barrel connector on the linkage.

When the gas pedal is depressed, the front carb works as it would normally, but the rod simply moves back and forth freely in the barrel connector in the rear carb. The linkage doesn't move, only the rod sliding through the connector.

Now, slide a thin spring (compressible not stretchable) over the portion of the rod that extends through the barrel connector and out the rear and fasten a round collar stop after the spring and tighten the tiny set screw on the collar.

Done.

Now, when the gas pedal is depressed, the front carb operates as it normally would, while the rod pulls forward in the barrel connect in the linkage of the rear carb. At first, there is no movement in the rear carb linkage, the rod just slides forward, but as the collar moves forward as well and the spring begins to compress against the barrel connector the linkage will also begin to move.

The spring acts as a progressive linkage element, moving the linkage marginally as it compresses, moving the linkage more and more until the spring is completely compressed and the linkage moves as it normally would. The collar stop holds tight against the rear of the spring so it HAS to compress, no option.

This works wonderfully. You can adjust things by moving the collar stop forward or back or changing the spring rate for a stiffer one/softer spring, but the progression is always there and doesn't become "all in" until a bit after 3/4 throttle, then kicks in right where it's needed, when you foot is all of the way to the floor.

Simple and sort of neat really. Hopefully you can imaging what I mean from the description. If you think about it, you can visualize it easily.

Luck,

TC
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Old November 25th, 2011, 05:38 PM   #23
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Default Re: stromberg 97's

Just to give you a rough idea of the linkage idea using something familiar to most of us. Imagine two stock Solex carbs mounted in-line on an extended length manifold such as you designed.

A basic throttle cable running up to them but fastened to a thin metal rod. Imagine the little end piece on the stock VW cable that fits into the barrel connector but extended to about six/seven inches long.

Easy to fashion out of tubing and JB Weld.

The rod runs through both barrel connectors on the carbs linkage arms. The front carb (closest to the down pipe) has the little screw tighten in on the barrel connector just like it was stock. Done, the rod is tightly in place just as though it was that little tube like extension on the end of a stock throttle cable.

The barrel connector on the rear most carb has no little set screw and the rod simply runs straight through the barrel connector on the linkage.

When the gas pedal is depressed, the front carb works as it would normally, but the rod simply moves back and forth freely in the barrel connector in the rear carb. The linkage doesn't move, only the rod sliding through the connector.

Now, slide a thin spring (compressible not stretchable) over the portion of the rod that extends through the barrel connector and out the rear and fasten a round collar stop after the spring and tighten the tiny set screw on the collar.

Done.

Now, when the gas pedal is depressed, the front carb operates as it normally would, while the rod pulls forward in the barrel connect in the linkage of the rear carb. At first, there is no movement in the rear carb linkage, the rod just slides forward, but as the collar moves forward as well and the spring begins to compress against the barrel connector the linkage will also begin to move.

The spring acts as a progressive linkage element, moving the linkage marginally as it compresses, moving the linkage more and more until the spring is completely compressed and the linkage moves as it normally would. The collar stop holds tight against the rear of the spring so it HAS to compress, no option.

This works wonderfully. You can adjust things by moving the collar stop forward or back or changing the spring rate for a stiffer one/softer spring, but the progression is always there and doesn't become "all in" until a bit after 3/4 throttle, then kicks in right where it's needed, when you foot is all of the way to the floor.

Simple and sort of neat really. Hopefully you can imaging what I mean from the description. If you think about it, you can visualize it easily.

Luck,

TC
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Old November 25th, 2011, 06:11 PM   #24
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Default Re: stromberg 97's

On my 1835 cc VW engine in my homebuilt airplane, the Zenith carb, (up draft) is under the engine at the flywheel end. The intakes are made from Lowe's box store Stainless Steel bathroom handrails, 1 1/4 ID. Right above the carb flange on the intake, I built a hot oil box to stop carb ice, and keeps the fuel charge from condencing before it gets to the heads. The oil runs from the oil pump cover to the hot oil box, ( cools the oil 20 degs) then to the oil cooler, and then to the oil filter and then back to the engine. Works great. To much carb is worse than to little. Pops
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Old November 25th, 2011, 06:15 PM   #25
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Default Re: stromberg 97's

the more i think about it the more im thinking of going with dual inline 34's or triple 30's
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